Follow Up - Hacker Balancing

  • Follow Up - Hacker Balancing

    On average, how much money should a single Bank Account Software give you? 3
    1.  
      $250 (Keep the Same) (1) 33%
    2.  
      $275 (0) 0%
    3.  
      $300 (0) 0%
    4.  
      $325 (0) 0%
    5.  
      $350 (0) 0%
    6.  
      $375 (1) 33%
    7.  
      $400 (0) 0%
    8.  
      $425 (0) 0%
    9.  
      $450 (Bring it back the way it was, Pre-Nerf) (1) 33%
























    The recent hacker nerf was a very big nerf, nearly cutting the amount of money you get in half. From what I can tell, nobody seems to think that hacker deserved the nerf it got.

    The reason why I thought hacker was quite op is that you made so much money from it, but I didn't once think about times where I would spend 2 hours straight just hacking, which is so much effort and the reward was good. I hacked 1600 computers which was around $360,000 and is not as overpowered as I thought (though with snowden it would be $540,000). I believe it be only little too good though.

    Anyways with this new information taken into account, hacker itself probably isn't what needs the nerf, snowden is probably what needs it. For my efforts, I personally believe the reward for normal hacker should be $300k, so almost back the way it was, a good reward for good effort but not too good.

    Doggy, I ask that you go by the votes. Nobody (as far as I'm aware) seems to think this nerf was a good idea, please allow us as a community democratically decide what the number should be for Bank Account Software. I really want you to understand that this really is a problem and basically every hacker has quit hacking because of this nerf. I'm emphasizing this because you haven't communicated with us that much about the hacker nerf and this is just my request for you.
  • For no risk moneymaking method the nerf was well justified. During graveyard hours you could grind that thing nonstop without a risk of losing a dime cause it going straight to your inventory. Then you can get instantly back to zero crime with one doorhack and cuffsaw.
  • Koipe wrote:

    For no risk moneymaking method the nerf was well justified. During graveyard hours you could grind that thing nonstop without a risk of losing a dime cause it going straight to your inventory. Then you can get instantly back to zero crime with one doorhack and cuffsaw.
    Except for the stuff being put into your inventory, this also applies to literally all jobs that give you crime.
  • Mandrew - Wonderland_War wrote:

    Koipe wrote:

    For no risk moneymaking method the nerf was well justified. During graveyard hours you could grind that thing nonstop without a risk of losing a dime cause it going straight to your inventory. Then you can get instantly back to zero crime with one doorhack and cuffsaw.
    Except for the stuff being put into your inventory, this also applies to literally all jobs that give you crime.
    Nope, printer and drugs are both required to collect and then move from your growing/printing place to the buyer and bank WITH the crime and product.
  • Koipe wrote:

    Nope, printer and drugs are both required to collect and then move from your growing/printing place to the buyer and bank WITH the crime and product.
    But you can still grind with both jobs nonstop with either during graveyard hours (not that it would be efficient with those jobs in particular), which was my point when it came to jobs that gave you crime. Robbers and Drug Runners can still grind and get a lot of crime when nobody else is around, just like hacking and they both have a higher payout than growing weed or printing.
  • Mandrew - Wonderland_War wrote:

    Koipe wrote:

    Nope, printer and drugs are both required to collect and then move from your growing/printing place to the buyer and bank WITH the crime and product.
    But you can still grind with both jobs nonstop with either during graveyard hours (not that it would be efficient with those jobs in particular), which was my point when it came to jobs that gave you crime. Robbers and Drug Runners can still grind and get a lot of crime when nobody else is around, just like hacking and they both have a higher payout than growing weed or printing.
    Risks are different. The nerf was 100% justified.
  • Koipe wrote:

    Mandrew - Wonderland_War wrote:

    Koipe wrote:

    Nope, printer and drugs are both required to collect and then move from your growing/printing place to the buyer and bank WITH the crime and product.
    But you can still grind with both jobs nonstop with either during graveyard hours (not that it would be efficient with those jobs in particular), which was my point when it came to jobs that gave you crime. Robbers and Drug Runners can still grind and get a lot of crime when nobody else is around, just like hacking and they both have a higher payout than growing weed or printing.
    Risks are different. The nerf was 100% justified.
    You have to hack 40 computers on average just to make $5000, you know what makes $5000 with much less effort and arguably the same or less amount of time? Growing Weed and waiting 13-15 minutes. The risk difference is also marginal, I can still drug run and rob while still making a lot of money and there's virtually no risk because players don't seem to want to kill others for the most part.
  • Mandrew - Wonderland_War wrote:

    Koipe wrote:

    Mandrew - Wonderland_War wrote:

    Koipe wrote:

    Nope, printer and drugs are both required to collect and then move from your growing/printing place to the buyer and bank WITH the crime and product.
    But you can still grind with both jobs nonstop with either during graveyard hours (not that it would be efficient with those jobs in particular), which was my point when it came to jobs that gave you crime. Robbers and Drug Runners can still grind and get a lot of crime when nobody else is around, just like hacking and they both have a higher payout than growing weed or printing.
    Risks are different. The nerf was 100% justified.
    You have to hack 40 computers on average just to make $5000, you know what makes $5000 with much less effort and arguably the same or less amount of time? Growing Weed and waiting 13-15 minutes. The risk difference is also marginal, I can still drug run and rob while still making a lot of money and there's virtually no risk because players don't seem to want to kill others for the most part.
    there's always the risk of dying. You also get these extra softwares that give you edge in the game. Arquably still the best method to do. Either grind Hacker or be lazier and afk drugs/printer.
  • Koipe wrote:

    there's always the risk of dying. You also get these extra softwares that give you edge in the game. Arquably still the best method to do. Either grind Hacker or be lazier and afk drugs/printer.
    The risk is too low to take into account for the most part. The extra software that's really only worth it is nocrime, banking software is only good when you're trapped inside the PD or something. Every hacker I've spoken to agrees that hacker just isn't worth it anymore after this harsh nerf. Lots of effort for mediocre pay. It's also not completely low risk, I once lost $1 million when trying to cash out my stuff because someone killed me. In addition to that, getting killed as a hacker disrupts the hacker's flow and I'm sure hackers will tell you that flow is extremely important.

    The post was edited 1 time, last by Mandrew - Wonderland_War ().

  • Actually, taking into account that there's a 25% chance to get a "tricky computer", it would actually be $93.75 per hack ($140.625 for snowden). So you actually have to hack 53-54 computers to get $5000. Now taking into account hacking software which gives you 2 softwares at random, it may be a bit less than that but I haven't done the math to figure that out yet.
  • I seriously do not get the hard on about buffing hacker that you have.

    if there are better jobs why not just do those ones if all you care about is pure money generation? What is the huge fascination about the hacker job. Kiope for once is entirely correct.

    There are zero risks associated with hacker— especially because you can cash out on graveyard hours and the crime production (not to mention cops have no ability to take software) is no where near as bad as drug grower (high crime, high risk). There is ZERO up front investment required why the hell would you get more than a job that has higher risk, higher crime production, and higher investment.

    it really should not be a difficult concept to understand different jobs have drawbacks and benefits no one job should make the rest obsolete— which is apparently what you would like.

    Also what dumbass runs around with 1 million dollars on then that’s completely a lapse in judgment and not at all a risk anyone would experience— should I just run around with drug runner money or drugs and never off set it or stagger the deposits to minimize my own risk?
  • eldrun wrote:

    I seriously do not get the hard on about buffing hacker that you have.

    if there are better jobs why not just do those ones if all you care about is pure money generation? What is the huge fascination about the hacker job. Kiope for once is entirely correct.

    There are zero risks associated with hacker— especially because you can cash out on graveyard hours and the crime production (not to mention cops have no ability to take software) is no where near as bad as drug grower (high crime, high risk). There is ZERO up front investment required why the hell would you get more than a job that has higher risk, higher crime production, and higher investment.

    it really should not be a difficult concept to understand different jobs have drawbacks and benefits no one job should make the rest obsolete— which is apparently what you would like.

    Also what dumbass runs around with 1 million dollars on then that’s completely a lapse in judgment and not at all a risk anyone would experience— should I just run around with drug runner money or drugs and never off set it or stagger the deposits to minimize my own risk?
    It's because every other hacker agrees that the nerf turned hacker basically into a worthless job. I've already mentioned that the risk of dying while doing a job is too low to consider, especially drug runner and robber because you can just deposit your money while you work, so losing your money while doing a job isn't that much of a concern. For weed specifically, it's not really that risky because you can just drop it in your house and save it there, then deposit when the time is right, and even when it isn't "right", the risk of dying with all that cash is still low because this isn't the old days anymore.

    As to why I'm fascinated, it's because the hacker job is just fun to me, but it's not as fun anymore knowing that I'll barely get anything for it. Also people are blaming me for the nerf and now I'm trying to increase the chance of it getting de-nerfed, I don't believe it should go back the way it was though because that would still be *too* good.

    Also the way I lost my money was that I was cashing out in the PD for maximum safety but someone saw how much crime I had, but I was too late to deposit the money with banking software, this proves that there is still a risk when doing hacker, albeit it's very low, just like the other jobs.
  • Mandrew - Wonderland_War wrote:

    eldrun wrote:

    I seriously do not get the hard on about buffing hacker that you have.

    if there are better jobs why not just do those ones if all you care about is pure money generation? What is the huge fascination about the hacker job. Kiope for once is entirely correct.

    There are zero risks associated with hacker— especially because you can cash out on graveyard hours and the crime production (not to mention cops have no ability to take software) is no where near as bad as drug grower (high crime, high risk). There is ZERO up front investment required why the hell would you get more than a job that has higher risk, higher crime production, and higher investment.

    it really should not be a difficult concept to understand different jobs have drawbacks and benefits no one job should make the rest obsolete— which is apparently what you would like.

    Also what dumbass runs around with 1 million dollars on then that’s completely a lapse in judgment and not at all a risk anyone would experience— should I just run around with drug runner money or drugs and never off set it or stagger the deposits to minimize my own risk?
    It's because every other hacker agrees that the nerf turned hacker basically into a worthless job. I've already mentioned that the risk of dying while doing a job is too low to consider, especially drug runner and robber because you can just deposit your money while you work, so losing your money while doing a job isn't that much of a concern. For weed specifically, it's not really that risky because you can just drop it in your house and save it there, then deposit when the time is right, and even when it isn't "right", the risk of dying with all that cash is still low because this isn't the old days anymore.
    As to why I'm fascinated, it's because the hacker job is just fun to me, but it's not as fun anymore knowing that I'll barely get anything for it. Also people are blaming me for the nerf and now I'm trying to increase the chance of it getting de-nerfed, I don't believe it should go back the way it was though because that would still be *too* good.

    Also the way I lost my money was that I was cashing out in the PD for maximum safety but someone saw how much crime I had, but I was too late to deposit the money with banking software, this proves that there is still a risk when doing hacker, albeit it's very low, just like the other jobs.
    So your solution to fixing hacker being a “useless job” is to again make every other job obsolete? Where is the sense in that.

    I do not disagree with you that inherent risks that used to be more prevalent back when the average player population was higher but there is no way that because you were being entirely careless with how you got your money from bank software the job is in turn risky.

    If anything jobs need to be revamped in a balance manner so they all have unique identities and purpose.

    As of now this is how they stand on current mechanics

    [Active] sanitation = No risk, No crime, low payout.
    [semi-Active]Robber = No investment, high crime, good payout, low-moderate risk.
    [Active]Drug Runner = Minimal investment, medium/low crime, decent payout, relative low risk
    [afk/semi-active]drug Grower = High payout, High Risk, investment, medium/high crime.
    [afk]Counterfeit = Good payout over long term/little work, investment, medium crime, medium risk
    [Active]Hacker = Zero investment, Zero Risk, medium crime (which is negligible with crime software), medium pay.

    what planet does the lowest risk job with ZERO Investment deserve the HIGHEST payout.
  • eldrun wrote:

    So your solution to fixing hacker being a “useless job” is to again make every other job obsolete? Where is the sense in that.
    I do not disagree with you that inherent risks that used to be more prevalent back when the average player population was higher but there is no way that because you were being entirely careless with how you got your money from bank software the job is in turn risky.

    If anything jobs need to be revamped in a balance manner so they all have unique identities and purpose.

    As of now this is how they stand on current mechanics

    [Active] sanitation = No risk, No crime, low payout.
    [semi-Active]Robber = No investment, high crime, good payout, low-moderate risk.
    [Active]Drug Runner = Minimal investment, medium/low crime, decent payout, relative low risk
    [afk/semi-active]drug Grower = High payout, High Risk, investment, medium/high crime.
    [afk]Counterfeit = Good payout over long term/little work, investment, medium crime, medium risk
    [Active]Hacker = Zero investment, Zero Risk, medium crime (which is negligible with crime software), medium pay.

    what planet does the lowest risk job with ZERO Investment deserve the HIGHEST payout.
    My comment about how back in the day dying was more risky was an ignorant statement by me so thanks for correcting me, you were there at the time and I wasn't.

    Minor correction, but Robber has a much lower payout than Drug Runner unless you Rob multiple NPCs, which wouldn't be as low, but still kind of low or medium.

    Can you explain how Counterfeitting and Growing Weed have medium-high risk? Not only are the chances of dying from someone low while you deposit your stuff (which won't take long to reach because bankers and weed buyers are common to see around the map), you can just sit in your house behind a lot of locks and nobody is going to attack you because of that, that's not very risky. Even if the risk is high, it's deserved because being inactive shouldn't pay better than being active.

    I also never claimed that it should have the highest payout, it just needs to be higher than it is now at least, $250 per bank account is cripplingly low and remember, 58 computers is $5400 on average, growing weed takes little to no effort and you can get the same in the same or less amount of time. Also do remember that low risk doesn't mean no cost, hacking gives a lot of crime and anyone could take your bounty at any time while you hack so there is still a downside.
  • Actually it is not that simple, yeah you can grow infinite drugs inside your place behind locks yeah, but crime amount tells directly when you plant your pots and collect them. Getting to the Monk and then to the bank is not the simpliest task. You can directly tell when to come behind your door/area around.
  • Koipe wrote:

    Actually it is not that simple, yeah you can grow infinite drugs inside your place behind locks yeah, but crime amount tells directly when you plant your pots and collect them. Getting to the Monk and then to the bank is not the simpliest task. You can directly tell when to come behind your door/area around.
    Do you mean that crime tells everyone when you pickup your stuff and then you can chase them with the weed? If so, that's a valid point and I've realized the same thing before, but the risk is still too low because most players seem to be respectful of each other instead of selfishly killing each other.

    Going to the monk, pressing E twice, then going to a banker and pressing E twice sounds very simple to me. Sure, there's some routes that reduce risk but it's still a simple dilemma of which path you want to go to.
  • Mandrew, chill bro. You are over critically thinking shit again. Hacking and Snowden has/had almost ZERO risk and with that it does not deserve to be the highest paying job. Almost zero chance of losing money, you can't drop bank account software if you get killed, cops can take it. You can cash it in at a computer next to a banker and almost never run the risk of being killed and losing it. If you choose to cash it in while in pd like you did is pure carelessness.

    Eldrun has explained it perfectly. Could not have said it better myself.

    The high pay was fun/great while it lasted but needed to be nerfed. Even limiting computers on a map does in no way reduce the amount of money one makes. As I have stated before, before you hack the entire map the 1st hacked terminal resets and can be hacked again.

    That being said, the bickering back and forth, trying to prove a false argument with ppl stops now, or I will close the post.

    If ppl want to post suggestions on how we could possibly change/improve hacking/Snowden is fine.

    From here on out, if it is not a suggestion please do not reply.
    "If his destiny be strange, it is also sublime." misslelauncher

    “From a caprice of nature, not from the ignorance of man. Not a mistake has been made in the working. But we cannot prevent equilibrium from producing its effects. We may brave human laws, but we cannot resist natural ones.”
  • I think it's time I actually offer a solution to the no-risk problem, make it so that you get an average of $325-$350 instead of receiving bank account software (alternatively we can make bank account software droppable, similar to weed) so there is a risk and the payout is worth it. If we were to use the direct money approach, the RP message could say something like:
    [RP] You stole $XXX from a bank account!

    The post was edited 1 time, last by Capt_n3Mo: SUGGESTIONS ONLY, REMOVED A REPLY ().

  • Closed! I SAID SUGGESTIONS ONLY!
    "If his destiny be strange, it is also sublime." misslelauncher

    “From a caprice of nature, not from the ignorance of man. Not a mistake has been made in the working. But we cannot prevent equilibrium from producing its effects. We may brave human laws, but we cannot resist natural ones.”
  • Users Online 1

    1 Guest